Comments on: Why Macs Will Never See Netflix Downloads

By: Marco Feindler

Marco Feindler — Tue, 26 Feb 2008 07:01:17 +0000

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By: Ross Moran

Ross Moran — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:40:09 +0000

I see you are tieing the CODEC to the DRM. FairPlay itself is not a CODEC. Which is what gives you the playback quality.

You can seperate the two functions.

There are lots of options for H.264 CODECs and players that will work off line without needing your iTunes player and living with the licensing terms.

And of course with an open standard like H.264 you can have an Open Standard for DRM and not have to choose Play Ready or Fairplay.

By: Sven Rafferty

Sven Rafferty — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 05:50:43 +0000

Yes, I mean downloads, as in H.264 is downloaded to your hard drive ala iTunes and you’re free to watch it when you’re ready and then the self-destruct timer begins, ala iTunes Rentals.

The issue with streaming is bandwidth and compression giving less than a please “HD” experience. NBC’s little venture after leaving iTunes is such an example of poor implementation of streaming. The quality is just not there and unless the content is downloaded, not streamed, it’s just not going to be a pleasing experience for most. No FairPlay alternative matches the quality of what Apple’s technology could provide at this point.

By: Ross Moran

Ross Moran — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:03:36 +0000

Hello Eytan,

I am not sure exactly where Sven was going but do not think it is an “either/or” decision here.

Silverlight, AIR, or whatever cross platform codec and framework you want to use would still need a DRM for NetFlix to satisfy the studios.

NetFlix has several choices

A Microsoft created DRM like “Play Ready” - As near as I can tell “Play Ready” is NOT ready yet.

FalirPlay - and we all know the problems that brings in regards to licensing - and there are still some studio requirements not met with FairPlay

Adobe’s FMS 3 based DRM - which at this point is not complete enough to meet studio needs

Or Widevine.

I will predict that NetFlix starts with progressive download on Mac and Linux using either Windows Media, H.264, FLV or VP7 for the formats. But will seek an open DRM that works on all platforms and formats…then maybe eventually they will consider downloads if the buisness model makes sence.

-Ross

By: Eytan

Eytan — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 19:44:24 +0000

Thanks Sven
I was under the impression that the mono project is porting Silverlight after a payout from MSFT
Regardeless. you mention and other mention other options, like Wildvine. Aren’t these all contradicting the thrust of this blog, that we will never see Netflix downloads? Or again, are you saying they WILL see streaming, but not downloads?
Eytan

By: Ross Moran

Ross Moran — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 17:55:03 +0000

Sven,

Not sure I mentioned the limitations of AIR and Silverlight. However, I must agree with your comments.

Additionally I would add. Adobe has not been able to understand or respond to the needs of the studios interms of robust DRM and keeps them from being the leader in this space over Microsoft. Even the Adobe story about how secure thier new DRM will be (still waiting for it) is flawed. They added some encryption and integrity checks to the SWF but failed to comprehend that those are not the attack points a pirate would use (beleive me I know ).

The Adobe approach to the problem is really just a ploy to get service providers like NetFlix to buy the Flash Media Server. The reality is that HTTP streaming is much more cost effective and if you use a good tool like Widevine’s the content is secure from the begining to the end.

In the end if the rumors are true and NetFlix is looking at Widevine, then they will have lots of option in terms of the platforms (PC, MAC, STB, PMP, Phones, DVD players, etc.) that thier customers can use to view NetFlix content. They also get freedom of choice in the area of media format, business models, and delivery protocals (streaming, progressive download, download).

All of this with a studio endorsed DRM.

Anyway I cannot wait to get instant watching capabiltities on my MAC

By: Sven Rafferty

Sven Rafferty — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 23:17:46 +0000

Ross is keen on the limitations of AIR and Silverlight and thus the negatives of these formats. Netflix has publicly demonstrated these technologies on the Mac; however, internally, Netflix is not banking on them due to their limitations. According to my source in a follow up, it is working with an unknown company to the masses in hopes that this could be the model to use for streaming to the Mac, Windows, AND Linux. Since Microsoft’s offering does not support Linux, Netflix is even more less likely to use Silverlight.

By: Eytan

Eytan — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:16:34 +0000

Thanks Ross. I think we agree on the point that Apple not licensing Fairplay is not holding back Netflix downloads, which was the point of this blog. All it is holding back is the creation of expiring media for the iPhone, that is if Netflix even acquired the rights for that. As far as I know, Netflix only has rights for playback on the desktop (and not any kind of portable media devices, other than portable DVD players if you got DVDs from them )

By: Ross Moran

Ross Moran — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:54:21 +0000

Hey Nick,

Rumor is NetFlix and Widevine are in discussions. I have not been able to conform it through NetFlix.

Also Eytan…I am pretty sure that Widevine has an player for protected play back of Mac downloads if NetFlix wanted to do downloads also.

Ross

By: Eytan

Eytan — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 00:53:15 +0000

P.S. UNLESS of course Netflix is planning on offering expiring media in addition to the streaming media - in which case, while not there yet is also part of the AIR and Silverlight initiatives… SPECIFICALLY because Apple does not open up Fairplay…